MD, PhD, MAE, FMedSci, FRSB, FRCP, FRCPEd.

The Corona Committee (Corona Ausschuss) was founded in Berlin in July 2020 by the lawyers Viviane Fischer, Antonia Fischer, Dr. Reiner Füllmich, and Dr. Justus Hoffmann. Its aim is to provide a “factual analysis” of the coronavirus events and the consequences of the measures taken against them. In live sessions lasting several hours, the committee hears experts from all COVID-affected fields.

In an interview, Dr. Fuellmich said: “The decision to set up a Corona Inquiry Committee came about in the first telephone conversation Viviane Fischer and I ever had. After I had spoken out in the USA via various videos since April 2020 about the fact that the principle ‘audiatur et altera pars’ (hear the other side as well) had been blatantly violated here on the part of the government, I had come back to Germany from the USA because I felt that this was now my place and that I had to stand up here to ensure that our democracy and our constitutional state did not go completely to the dogs. I wanted to organize a symposium on the legal issues surrounding Corona, but I didn’t know any critical lawyers in Germany. I called my old friend Dr. Wolfgang Wodarg, whom I knew from the Justice Working Group at Transparency International, and he then referred me to Viviane Fischer.”

The ‘Speerspitze‘, an “anonymous collective of contrarians, Corona deniers, Nazi witches and conspiracy heretics” considers the work of the Corona Committee to be “one of the most important pillars of the fight against the madness to which we have been subjected for the last year and a half and [has] great respect for all the activists, actors, and interviewees of the Committee who publicly denounce with their name and face what is happening.” Numerous further websites have joined in the promotion of the Corona Committee.

However, if you look at the information that the Corona Committee is disseminating, and if you are able to think critically, you are likely to come to very different conclusions:

– There is the expert who warns that the unvaccinated could soon be picked up and put into concentration camps. There is the threat of a “manhunt”, and loving parents might then have to hide their children under the boards of the floor at home to prevent them from being sprayed to death.

– There is the man who claims that Israel’s government is currently carrying out a holocaust on its own population (“You can see that by how many people are dying from the vaccinations”). A guest declares that there are “something like living octopuses” in the vaccine against Corona.

Anyone who takes a look at the many tediously long videos will quickly realize that every Corona denier, vaccination opponent, conspiracy theorist, mask opponent, and lateral thinker, no matter how paranoid, have their say here and spreads their pipe dreams under the guise of evidence-based information with the nodding approval of the lawyers present. Opposition is never raised and there is no trace of ‘audiatur et altera pars’; everyone agrees: worldwide, all governments are hell-bound at smashing everything there is to govern.

For those who are still not fed up, the website of the Corona Committee offers written answers to 31 very specific questions. Here is just one.

QUESTION: IS THE COVID-19 DISEASE SEVERE AND WIDESPREAD?

ANSWER: No, most people have no or only mild flu symptoms. Children and adolescents are extremely rarely affected. Post-mortem examinations by a Hamburg forensic pathologist on over 100 elderly people who died with a positive corona test revealed at least one other serious cause of death in all cases. Other published figures are mostly based on non-transparent attributions and assumptions without excluding other causes. Often, no attention was even paid to other pathogens or previous medication.

Factual analyses?

Afraid not!

For a long time, I have been wondering where the penetratingly vociferous opposition to COVID vaccinations in Germany might come from. After studying the dangerous nonsense that the Corona Committee has been spreading for many months, I wonder a little less.

(texts in German were translated by me)

47 Responses to The ‘Corona Committee’ in Berlin: There are live octopuses in the vaccines

  • A team of over 1,000 lawyers and over 10,000 medical experts led by Dr. Reiner Fuellmich have begun legal proceedings against the CDC, WHO & the Davos Group for crimes against humanity.

    https://rightsfreedoms.wordpress.com/2021/05/12/covid-fraud-lawyers-medical-experts-start-legal-proceedings-against-w-h-o-and-world-leaders-for-crimes-against-humanity/

    • “the “experimental” vaccine itself is in violation of Article 32 of the Geneva Convention. Under Article 32 of the 1949 Geneva Convention IV, “mutilation and medical or scientific experiments not necessitated by the medical treatment of a protected person” are prohibited. According to Article 147, conducting biological experiments on protected persons is a grave breach of the Convention.”
      WHAT A LOAD OF BS!

    • You are nothing but Corona-denying troll. Go back to your swamp and continue playing there with your empty-headed friends.

      PS: The Corona-Ausschuss consists of a handful of lawyers and another handful of physicians without experience in virology, immunology, or epidemiology.

    • “1000 lawyers and 10,000 medical experts”

      Ahahahahahahaha. All unnamed. Presumably because we wouldn’t know them because they go to a different school.

      And that load of specious one-eyed twaddle is from May, Ruthy. What’s happened since?

      Nothing.

    • Ruthy,
      you may want to know that Füllmich is a notorious German lawyer, who lately initiated several (pseudo-)lawsuits.
      His shady business model is very well explained by Chan-jo Jun (…i.e. an HONEST lawyer) in this video (from 09:11 onwards): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WMx0PLt1JX4

    • Taken from the cited website :

      https://rightsfreedoms.wordpress.com/about/

      “We are being played

      (…)In conclusion we are being played by a Divide and Conquer Strategy that various elites have used to control the masses for thousands of years. We are in the midst of the 4th Industrial Revolution right now where the elite wants to control all of us: through mass surveillance, 5G infrastructure, tracking us through biometric ID and and mass vaccination for population control. (Bill Gates).”

      If you are that delusional and disconnected from reality, congratulations, you’ve played yourself.

      • Julien

        My response to you.
        YOU”RE more disconnected from reality than YOU think…. if you buy into the vaccination mandate farce. It’s a lie.

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z4MXVBqlPg4&t=239s
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jv3Q74CLU1c

        • LOL….who is disconnected from reality Ruthy?

          Allow me to point out that your sources are two YouTube influencers: a computer guy and a retired nurse educator (who started making money promoting shoddy science, after pandemic hit: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Campbell_(YouTuber)). I guess you are gullible enough to get influenced by those two YT buffoons and don’t even realize that you are helping them get rich by sharing their YT links.

          • To all

            I bid you farewell

            I stumbled on to this website three years ago. At first glance, I assumed that the participants here were seeking solutions to medical issues. In a large way, I was wrong, nothing to see here… move along.

            I started initially posting as RG, but the professor grew to dislike RG’s views…. so RG got blocked. Then the moniker Listener was adapted, Listener got banned also…. and so it was with Bart. Ruthy has been blocked also… but some messages are still posted. We’ll see about this final post.
            Kudos to a couple of posters here, who were able to detect that the different monikers were the same person.

            I have learned here over the past three years, that the professor has his own agenda. I initially presumed that the professor was a fair moderator, I found out differently.
            The professor controls the discussion here, he has blocked my “evidence” many times. He does this because he doesn’t like it when a narrative is expressed other than what he approves (even if he’s wrong). This makes the forum postings subject to his narrow opinion.

            I get it, it’s his forum. His platform to promote his books to discredit homeopathy. Knock your socks off professor, make your money. In the end, just realize that those whom choose homeopathy, or choose not to subject themselves to CONmed do have their reasons. Furthermore, it’s their freedom to be medically treated as they choose.

            This forum is full of closed minds, minds made up with, and polluted by CONmed fallacies. Sheeple, following the modern day Western medical narrative…. all under the guise of “SCIENCE”. Oh yes, there are some bright people here, perhaps too clever for their own good health.

            I’ve enjoyed reading many many posts here, including message posts from those that disagree with me and my views. .
            A special thanks to one man…. Dr. JMK. Even though I found that I seldom agreed with the Dr.. However, the good doctor always responded to me respectfully, with great patience. He would present his case, and do so without offending. Dr. JMK, you are a true gentleman, and I appreciate your knowledge and insights.

            Special thanks also to Roger, who as far as I know coined the term … CONmed…. for which I shall continually be… L_aughing M_y A_ss O_ff.

            I’ll sign off now, before I’m blocked again…. farewell
            RG

          • “Kudos to a couple of posters here, who were able to detect that the different monikers were the same person.”
            It was fairly obvious to many of us.
            I kept you on for entertainment value, as your refusal or inability to learn is outstanding.

          • @Ruthy/RG/Bart/Listener

            Kudos to the Professor for giving you and other trolls a lot of leeway on his blog. Regulars to this blog are very familiar with you and your interactions with the Professor that got you banned. Several of those interactions involved outright belligerence and name-calling on your part. So don’t act like you got banned for nothing and cry crocodile tears.

            I was going to say mission accomplished and retire my Talker moniker. However, despite your so-called farewell note, I have a feeling that you will be back soon, with a new sock puppet to spew your ignorant bullshit. So, I will keep using my moniker for the time being. Anyway, so long pal! Don’t let the door hit you on the way out.

          • Ruthy!!!

            You are leaving me here to fend for myself? Who am I going to pitch my shiny new SCAM’ey ideas to? I am very saddened, and heart broken by your decision.

            Honestly, I didn’t realize you were the person behind all those monikers. You certainly duped me; you wile Ruthy! No matter which moniker you were using, you were always there proving your valuable insight and with you help I am very close to unveiling a new SCAM for you to try. I am pretty sure you tried some of the remedies I suggested in the past; especially the ones that involve cows. You are the most gullible rube who would believe anything and everything on the internet and I will always fondly remember you that way. Regardless of where you end up, stay strong and do not stop using my cow dung remedies, esp. the one where you smear all your body, first thing in the morning, with fresh bullshit.

            Stay true to yourself and remember, as long as you have cowpathy you don’t have to rely on big pharma remedies at all. That said, with a heavy heart I bid you farewell Ruthy!

            Your truly,
            Honest Ape

          • Ruthy

            Mind the door doesn’t hit you on the arse on your way out.

            We’ll see you next time when you pop up again spouting your newest iteration of pathetic and ill-informed garbage.

        • Don’t lose heart Ruthy. There are still so many of us and the numbers are growing even amongst the now regretful vaccinated and tracked.
          I know you won’t be swayed by some of these utter smartarses and their glee filled satisfaction at the gang up against you.

          To said smartarses… I don’t and won’t claim I know what on earth is going on. Only that I’m convinced something is seriously wrong here. There is an agenda I’m sure.

          All of you who pay blind obedience, I ask for one little concession…
          Please get your govt vaccine and lockdown experts to simply DEBATE the skeptics instead of ridicule, censorship and deplatforming. For that approach my fine fair foes only breeds more suspicion.
          Debate, release all these secretive facts and backroom hush deals.
          Answer your critics. Cut this childish gang up bullying approach. And govts please … Transparency, not censorship, mandates, threats and exclusions from society unless line is toed.

          Bye,
          Brent Rossiter.

          dox me, I don’t give a.!

          • @Brent Rossiter

            I don’t and won’t claim I know what on earth is going on. Only that I’m convinced something is seriously wrong here.

            Yes, we have a nasty virus that has killed several million people already(*), that is what is wrong.

            There is an agenda I’m sure.

            This shows that you are human – because it is a very human trait to attribute major events (and especially disasters) to human or human-like origins, even if said events were in fact the result of coincidence or other non-human factors. Any disaster in history saw the emergence of people who ‘were sure’ that there must have been something fishy going on – simply because we’re very bad at accepting things such as blind chance and bad luck.

            All of you who pay blind obedience, I ask for one little concession…

            I ask for one little concession too: if you want to be taken seriously in debate, then please stop using demeaning phrasing such as ‘blind obedience’. Many people who support Covid-countermeasures and vaccination do so because they are well-informed and understand the science behind it, NOT because of ‘blind obedience’. If anything, ‘skeptics’ are the ones who blindly trust and follow the pedlars of all sorts of misinformation, simply because it confirms their beliefs.

            Please get your govt vaccine and lockdown experts to simply DEBATE the skeptics …

            This has been attempted lots of times, but for a fruitful debate, both sides should at least agree on the basic facts. Unfortunately, this kind of common ground is mostly absent, and your comments bear witness to this: you ‘are sure’ that some sort of nefarious conspiracy is going on (“There’s an agenda’), and you demand to ‘release all these secretive facts and backroom hush deals.”

            Let me ask you this: what if there aren’t any secretive facts and backroom hush deals?(**) What if there isn’t an agenda? One problem I see is that you ‘are sure’ of things for which there is no evidence, and that almost certainly do not exist. But as this non-existence is literally impossible to prove, this also means that debate about it is rather difficult. All I can do is acknowledge that you believe in some vague conspiracy, which makes you distrust all scientific and medical information – and then state my own point of view that no such conspiracies exist.

            Another problem is that ‘skeptics’ propagate all sorts of untruths, e.g. that vaccines they kill or at least harm lots of people. Their ‘evidence’ consists of anything ranging from completely wrong interpretations of VAERS data(***) to things that are 100% made up (e.g. that the vaccines would alter our DNA).

            So how can we debate with people who don’t accept many basic facts about the very subject of the debate?

            *: A number that would be even far higher without countermeasures and vaccinations.

            **: Apart of course from the normal tendency of some people to try and abuse situations for their own gain, political or otherwise (a.k.a. opportunism). The pandemic is no exception here – here in the Netherlands, it turned out that one entrepreneur made millions in the early stages by charging extortionate prices for rather inferior face masks, while at the same time vehemently denying those profits, and claiming that he only ‘wanted to help people’.
            And unfortunately, it appears that especially right-wing political groups increasingly use the pandemic to stoke fears and spread fake news in order to attract voters and supporters, politicizing and polarizing a debate that should only be about public health. This is not only happening in the US, but in other countries such as Germany as well.

            ***: Which has some of these ‘skeptics’ led to claim that 1 in every 1,000 Covid-19 vaccinations causes death. Which can’t be true, if only because that would mean that vaccinations would have caused more deaths than the death toll attributed to Covid-19 – not to mention the fact that the majority of those deaths happened before the start of vaccinations.

          • Richard Rasker. Thank you, I appreciate the time you put into each point. I can’t say it has changed anything however. Just for instance, I’m from New Zealand so I can only speak for N.Z.
            There is no transparency pure and simple. And no dissension is allowed.
            Sorry, but that’s not the way to instill confidence and trust. It’s basically get double vaccinated, install the tracer app, which I suspect maybe the “Agenda” yes, I said it again, agenda all along.
            A couple of days ago I came across one persons 31 requests under our freedom of information act. about 3 were partially resolved, the rest yet to respond, long overdue or outright denied.
            Great reassurance. Now 5-11yr olds are being vaccinated from next month. After one death they said from covid. I’d like to just take their word, but until they’re up front I just don’t believe a thing.
            There are most definitely deaths and bad side effects from these vaccines, so to stick it into half a million 5-11yr olds just doesn’t justify the risk in my opinion. Afterall, it doesn’t stop any of them catching and passing it on.
            And then there’s dr fauci and the wuhan gain of function link. Same guy responsible is same guy with solution. I guess you’re going to tell me that all conspiracy theory too huh.
            Final note before I finish, You won’t sway my opinion so how much time you choose to put into a reply is up to you.

            Thanks.

            Brent.

          • @Brent Rossiter

            There are still so many of us and the numbers are growing even amongst the now regretful vaccinated and tracked.

            Sorry, but that’s not the way to instill confidence and trust. It’s basically get double vaccinated, install the tracer app, which I suspect maybe the “Agenda” yes,

            Certainly, getting tracked is an inevitability every vaccinated person has to deal with. I got double vaccinated before I realized that they included trackers and tracer apps in the vaccine. I used to hear voices in my head, kind of like the crosstalk you hear on the old landline phone sometimes. It is the 5G chip that is included in the tracker causing the crosstalk, especially when you are close to another double vaccinated person. To avoid getting tracked, a tinfoil hat is not sufficient, because the tracker is circulating in your bloodstream, and it could be anywhere in your body. That means, you will have to wrap your entire body in tinfoil, like so: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VIu4UYpARzs. After that I stopped hearing voices, which tells me that the tracker’s 5G chip is unable to communicate with the mothership. Bingo! Problem solved. That is how you avoid getting tracked by Bill Gates and any other nefarious actors like the UN and your government. I hope you learned something from my experience.

            Stay wrapped my friend.

            Tin Tin

          • Richard Rasker,
            Aaah, agree on basic facts you say. That’s the reason you claim…
            O.K, I gotcha now. Agree with the official narrative then we’ll debate.
            Right. I got it now. One side won’t agree to submit to the other before the debate.
            No problem. And no surprise either.
            My way – Highway type thing huh.

          • Sorry Richard to add again, but blind obedience is precisely what I’ve seen from people I know.
            But you claim it’s because all these people “Understand the Science”
            Really..? Are you sure about that. 80-90% of people understand vaccine science….?
            Unless the dutch are naturally born with highly scientifically evolved minds, or PHD’s in medical science is mandatory, I really don’t think you can back that claim up.

            Here, a lot did initially out of very blind obedience. I know because I’ve asked various friends and family. The rest eventually gave in and accepted because, no, not because they understood the Science Richard, not at all. Only so they could have restrictions lifted.
            In fact I can’t think of one single soul who understood the science.
            That claim Richard I’m afraid is rubbish.

          • Brent; fair points.

            Richard; please explain Waterford Ireland which went from the lowest infection rate to being the highest in Ireland after 99.7 vaccination rate…?
            And not just infections but hospitalizations and ICU beds…. Anyone have an idea if you’re all so scientifically clued up and adamantly right….?
            Anyone falsely and maliciously profiting out of this is simply a conman criminal scumbag potential ddanger if not murderer. I don’t think you can put that on the skeptic community. (Including Gates Fauci & Big Pharma if that shown to be the case) Well I guess you could try to, but it’d be disingenuous in my opinion.

            And the bioweapon research at the Wuhan lab and Faucis involvement….?
            True or Rightwing Stirrings…?
            Why self proclaimed experts, has the virus not slowed up but increased apparently worldwide after how many vaccines administered….? It must be in the billions.
            The unvaxxed I presume you’ll come back with, but I really think that would be quite a statement given Waterford.
            Do co-morbidity factors play any part in your scenario of truth and facts….?

            Just a few questions. A few wee points for you bang on dead right scientific experts here.
            Very confidently self assured of yourselves I’m sure you’ll be able to clear them up no problems at all.

            At least Brent stated he doesn’t know what’s the actual truth, even though I have a couple of minor issues with his rebuttals to Richard, he’s not claiming to know it all but is seemingly just looking for answers.
            And I don’t think you guys here are giving much besides We’re Right!!

            Will.B

          • @Brent Rossiter

            A couple of days ago I came across one persons 31 requests under our freedom of information act.

            Yes, we have people like that here too. They seem to have issues with the fact that deliberations between epidemiologists, virologists and politicians do not happen publicly, and that there is no opportunity for laypersons to join the debate. So they demand transcripts of every word spoken during those meetings, and then complain when not all transcripts are available immediately afterwards, and again write protest letters if they think that those transcripts do not reflect exactly what was said. Some of these people even start lawsuits (financed by their supporters), demanding that all measures are immediately lifted and all vaccinations immediately halted pending any ‘unanswered questions’. These lawsuits are of course thrown out of court, and even though the demanded documents are eventually produced, any answers these people get only prompt them to file more demands for information, waving the already acquired documents around as ‘evidence’ that “there are lots of things that we are not told!” and “we have a right to know!”. But alas, because nothing they receive ever confirms or even supports their preconceived beliefs in any tangible way, they are never satisfied.

            Now 5-11yr olds are being vaccinated from next month. After one death they said from covid.

            Not only because of one death, but also because it helps curb spread of the disease.

            I’d like to just take their word, but until they’re up front I just don’t believe a thing.

            I think that the NZ authorities are up front, but that you decided not to trust them. Which is a bit of an issue, because in the end, you will have to trust someone’s word for anything. And from your comments I gather that you trust people who disseminate far worse information than the government.

            There are most definitely deaths and bad side effects from these vaccines

            I recall UK figures where 5 deaths may(!) be attributed to vaccination – all in elderly people. Which would equal to roughly 1 death per 20 million vaccinations. I think that this is a negligible number, especially when compared to 1 death per 140 Covid-19 infections.

            so to stick it into half a million 5-11yr olds just doesn’t justify the risk in my opinion.

            Yes, it does. Covid-19 infection kills one child per 500,000, which, although very low, is still considerably more than vaccination.

            Afterall, it doesn’t stop any of them catching and passing it on.

            Oh yes, it does – just not with 100% efficacy. But vaccinations certainly help curb the spread of the disease.

            You won’t sway my opinion

            Indeed I won’t, because that is something that you will have to do yourself. I’m already content that you read the comments here and care to respond. Just as you suggested: a polite debate is the basis of mutual understanding.

            Agree with the official narrative then we’ll debate.

            No, I’m not talking about narratives, but about facts. If you read ‘narrative’ where I say ‘facts’, and consider your own unproven suspicions ‘facts’, then I’m afraid that sensible debate indeed becomes pretty difficult.

            but blind obedience is precisely what I’ve seen from people I know.

            Is adhering to traffic laws done out of ‘blind obedience’? Do you pay taxes because of ‘blind obedience’? Have you attended school because of …? Oh, wait … (sorry, lame joke, couldn’t resist). Anyway, following particular rules or directions is only ‘blind obedience’ if it is unclear to you why you do it, and only do it because you’re told to, without any further explanation or justification.

            But you claim it’s because all these people “Understand the Science”

            Yep, and the science is pretty simple: vaccines prevent disease and are extremely safe. Which means that getting vaccinated protects not only the person vaccinated, but also other people they come into contact with. And yes, the vast majority of people here in the Netherlands understands this and therefore gets vaccinated at the first opportunity.
            But don’t people in New Zealand learn these basic scientific facts about vaccines? Then you may be right, and your government is indeed keeping you in the dark …

          • Richard; please explain Waterford Ireland which went from the lowest infection rate to being the highest in Ireland after 99.7 vaccination rate…?

            Easy, Brent. Human factors. And hospitalizations and deaths remain low in Waterford because the prevention of death and serious illness is the primary task of vaccines. Interesting that you have to pick a statistical outlier in one small area in one small nation to try to prop up your facile argument whilst ignoring the fact that ICU and hospital beds across the world are predominantly filled with the unvaccinated.

            My wife is an ICU nurse, Brent. She’s gone in to work today to do another 14 hour shift after a week off. Her first text to me today: “2/3 of our COVIDs are unvaccinated. Selfish bastards!!” Yes, Brent. You and your ignorant, selfish ilk, desperate to prop up your deficient egos by imagining you’re special. You aren’t. You’re just idiots.

            Your numbers are decreasing day by day, though, as COVID takes its Darwinian toll of fools. The pity is that the likes of my wife have to waste their time looking after you all.

          • @W Bowman

            please explain Waterford Ireland which went from the lowest infection rate to being the highest in Ireland after 99.7 vaccination rate…?

            You sound exactly like those global warming denying people, who pointed to a small corner of Greenland that had seen colder than average weather for three years in a row, and claimed that this ‘proved’ that the global climate wasn’t warming at all – completely ignoring the fact that even 300 miles further inland, millions of square miles of ice sheet were melting under summer temperatures never recorded in Greenland in human history. Or, in other words: you can always find an unexpected result if you search good enough.
            Anyway, I had to look up Waterford, and found the following:
            “99.7% of all adults in the county have been fully vaccinated against the virus …”
            Which means that you are not telling the truth. In reality, only about 75% of the population (= 18+) is fully vaccinated. Those 1.3 million NOT fully vaccinated children and adolescents are most likely contributing significantly to the spread of the disease.

            And not just infections but hospitalizations and ICU beds….

            And this is another lie from your mouth:
            “Hospitalisation figures, and intensive care unit admissions, are stable and decreasing slightly in recent days. It’s widely accepted the “vaccine wall” has driven serious illness and death figures down.”
            And while we’re at it, from the first linked article:
            “Last month, it emerged that Co. Monaghan had the lowest vaccine uptake of any county in Ireland, and simultaneously had the country’s worst 14-day incidence rate.”

            Anyone have an idea if you’re all so scientifically clued up and adamantly right….?

            See Lenny’s comment above and the articles I linked to. This has nothing to do with being scientifically adamant, and everything with NOT believing lies such as the ones you spout.

            And the bioweapon research at the Wuhan lab and Faucis involvement….?

            Ah, now it has become ‘Fauci involved in bioweapons’ … the highly suggestive lies keep just rolling out your mouth …

            True or Rightwing Stirrings…?

            These are indeed lies from some notorious US Republican misfits.

            Why self proclaimed experts, has the virus not slowed up but increased apparently worldwide after how many vaccines administered….?

            Because the virus has become at least several times as contagious compared the original Covid-19 virus. And without vaccinations and coutermeasures, the estimated death toll would have been about three or four times the current 5+ million, not to mention hundreds of millions with chronic health issues as a result of an infection. Even now, vaccination significantly decreases the impact of an infection, preventing huge numbers of hospitalizations and deaths.

            At least Brent stated he doesn’t know what’s the actual truth,

            And yet another lie. Brent literally states that he knows for sure that there are sinister things going on, and that this is why he won’t believe anything that scientists and governments say, and thus won’t do what they ask him to do.

            I hope this answers your questions.

          • Well i unsubscribed after a rather, well from what I felt was a quite dismissive retort, certainly seemed to be intended. And totally pointless. A fairly demeaning comment from the webhost.
            I was very serious, stating that I just don’t know and really hope humanity goes on and upwards from here, Well, the jokes on me I guess for opening my heart, admitting I don’t know where the truth lies. But do want the best for all.

            If it costs me my life, I’d go happily knowing the life I grew up with in the 70’s N.Z is not a childhood that’s never again to be experienced. Nothing special it was, it just was. 4 kids, Mum at home and Dad a Milkman. And no ridicule. I suspect some words I write are simply waiting to be pounced on, twisted moulded to hurl back as a weapon of bullying, ridicule, and an unbending view and will to simpy impose, like some cia experiment. Sorry, just how it felt on first visit.

            Not everyone whos replied have I found like that. In fact Richard, thanks friend. We never resolved much, nor agreed on a lot. YET, Richard is someone who I feel I could discuss debate or whatever in a rational time thought way. And yet I still think there wasn’t anything really new or eye opening for me to use or help ease my cynicism of govt big tech/pharma..lets bring oil too in and online advertising, retail/amazon…. OK! I’ll JUST SAY BIG THEN!!
            but full praise to anyone who takes the time like that to address points in that way.
            Thanks Richard Rasker

            OK, the other respectfully written reply…
            Tin Tin. Yes, thank you. I have never gotten quite to that stage of fear, nor any really maor paraoia etc, It sounded pretty damn awful.
            My suspicion is simply that. A suspicion that something feels like its going on here. More like a feeling this isn’t happening to us, but is being done to us. If there really is nothing, no nefarious collaboration of elite zog nwo wef masonic communists. Ok, enough of that, mine is based on my lifelong love of history.

            Up until not that long ago I was thrust into the uncensored unedited version of history and how incredibly evil sinister and just so sadistic some people are and the lengths that some in power & wealthy who want power are are willing to go. So lives mean less than little, even sacrificing entire races & nations to perish, starve, or be slaughtered mean nothing if they believe its reaching a goal in their overall plan.
            Power and Money attract individuals with these certain attributes. Also there are those that lead just for the love of their people. But today I believe there are few to none of these. For to get to the top you must’ve been groomed and selected. The WEF young leaders thing I’m referring to here, but surely there are others and many for tsuper elite few.

            Ok, move on please….. (brain)

            I’m honestly not sure if you folk believe in the wuhan lab, or a natual occurring mutation. I’d thought it was generally accepted now it was indeed the wuhab lab. That alone is a very cynical aspect of it for myself..

            Aaah, Lenny. I didn’t actually pick anything. I think you maybe referring to a post by Will or Bill.
            Sorry, it is Will.B. Thanks Will, and I really did appreciate that bit of support at a time where I have voluntary entered the ‘Enemy Camp’ (Don’t take too literally please) alone without my secret service back up squad parked across the road. I only stopped in to reply. As, from what I saw here was a quite distasteful near cyber mobbing of a Woman who I assume just wanted to share and learn info. I don’t know this persons longer history, and wont get into that. I’m sure you’ll all have a long list. It’s a mute point however and not worth anymore time.
            What I saw here however was not a good look.

            Richard, again friend, As long as I’ve know you, I feel a knd of Love Hate type feeling. Or as we’ve just barely only briefly interacted I’ll say like/dislike. You write well, address point by point with a few ever so sutle complimates….uhh, no, umm,… say more like friendly reassururing phrases might explain them best. Before the point by point rebuttals come on hard, which honestly for me, all I read is more of the ‘This IS Right’ type stuff that will never satisfy many or me, nor ease my suspicions. People are all different and some want or need the facts as raw data, and other information that’s not twisted one way or another. Statistics everyone surely knows can be selectively used for almost any agenda. Peoples of all nations have believed and had faith in govt and experts before, and it has been disastrous for them their families aentire bloodlines, village and entire Nations. Transparency must be better if we get through this and encounter the next great whatever.. ohh, Better finish up, well past beddy byes.

            Oh, and of course Will.B. Yor reference to my initial rebuttal to Richard, well yes I took your saying that more of interest because of your first comment that I had some good points. So I’ve given it as critical eye as I could. I appreciated your comment and critical eye. Great questions.
            I don’t know if you’re still following this Will but I’d have liked an ally or even some more objectivity. Beginning from being told what is fact because it just is, Well for me it’s not a good starting point (True or Not) Discussions must include whats claimed to be unquestionable.
            (Unless it’s the teleknesis from the aliens beneath the earths crust causing all this crust)
            You should find barely scarcely few if any, the nuttier claimss like that get. I hope?!!!
            Pandemic or not, full unrestricted open free and fair debates are invaluable.Every aspect of it.
            Also I know there is so much very toxic misinfo that’s so bad I can’t see anyone objecting to simply ignore (possibly bann it if its just becoming an overturned tanker on the highway) I’m referring to the totally ludicrous. Many though do have what appear to me as genuine concerns.
            So heres some I could or should have done better or not at all.

            Richard-1) My ending on reply-1, – “You wont sway my opinion” so how much time you choose to put into a reply is up to you.

            Well of course that was just silly and as ill thought out an ending as I’ve done for a while. I’m totally not close minded as that states.

            Richard-2) In Repy 3 I gave numbers from what I’d seen and known here in NZ. However rereading your claim, as I interpret it now at least, you say “Many people who support Covid-countermeasures and vaccination” – Which I now take as meaning the promotors like govts Dr’s and Health officials. And not the everyman and woman simply deciding to get the vaccine, while relying on the honestly and integrity of the former. I hope I’ve captured your meaning there.

            Totally overlooked that.

            Third reply, I didn’t enjoy getting snarky like that -, but really that is no way at all to begin a debate. I don’t know what this or these “Facts” were, but for that it must have completely undermined the point of debating entirely. For me personally, its the one thing I have really wanted hoped and needed to see. Very frustrating. What was this Fact/s that the other side had to accept as Fact.? That answer may be very helpful to me I’m sure. Possibly revealing.

            I’ll stop here.

            Hey, well I checked back in from curiously. And spent more time than intended. I wont be resubbing, as it’s a bit set for me. Curiously I’m sure will pull me to a read maybe. I’m not tring to disparage anyone and it is good that comments from both views (and any between) remain up. So good on you Edzard for that. As still slightly irritated as I am over () comment that I felt quite unnecessary.
            Tiz what is is tho, certainly I’ve had far worse so no big deal.

            Hope Everyone here without exception can look back and read this in 2030 while living a freer fuller and happier life. Genuinely I do.
            If someone writes, yes we’ll all be here reading except you’ll have long succumbed. well, I hop not. Tosee tha written or succumb.

            Way way past bedtime. And Mums asleep and wont make me another hot chocolate. Gonna have to change my own nappies too. that’s Diapers to you Ameris. Hard night ahead indeed.

            Hey, Richard. Just scrolled past you saying, “Brent literally states that he knows for sure that there are sinister things going on”

            What part are you meaning? I’m beginning to go off you a bit now mate. Ive a fairly strong feeling, and certainly if you look through history unedited youll definitely find this is continuously happening.
            But I’d like to see what I said that you went so far to HIGHLIGHT IN BOLD. So by doing that, I must assume you’ve seen me write that. Maybe… ? Hey, I am as honest as I consciously am able, and sure I do strongly believe that. Ive said I don’t know exactly what the “Agenda” and I probably said that I’m sure there is one. THAT IS NOT STATING I KNOW FOR A FACT RICHARD.

            >Like 2 people at a bus stop and one says I’m sure there’ll be a bus tonight. That sounds to me hopeful, optimistic and believing that ones coming. NOT FACTUAL KNOWLEDGE. Richard.?

            I will check back at some time soon. I’ve just spent considerable time correct some things I thought needed. Like I say, I am as honest as consciously able. I’d never put flat honest or dead bang on right. I try my damn best.

          • RICHARD.

            And yet another lie. Brent literally states that he knows for sure that there are sinister things going on, and that this is why he won’t believe anything that scientists and governments say, and thus won’t do what they ask him to do.

            Thats really quite underhanded howyou’ve put that. Its deliberately misleading.
            Saying Im sure there’ll be a bus tonight is NOT STATING FACT.

            Iv’e just spent considerable time tidying up a few things.
            Because if anything Richard , I am as honest as I’m conciouslyv able.
            I don’t know why you’d frame that in such a way to as it seems deliberately misrepresent me.
            I really did think more of you mate, just read my last comment. Now I really don’t know.

            As I have said Richard, I’m sure (not i know for fact) that something is going on, an Agenda.

            I’M CLAIMING NO SUCH FACTUAL KNOWLEDGE. I’d have to lie to say I knew as YOU REPRESENTED IT.

            One thing I am not is a damned LIAR. Every concious effort and thought is the truth as known to me.

            Gee,, Theres nothing quite like your character and integrity being had a hack job done on it. I’m quite mad. Especially after writing what I just did before. I thought you were fair and descent despite our opposing views.
            Its humanity in the end. Virus Vaccine Mask Lockdown.
            Humanity is all we need to absolutely hang on to at all costs.

            GOODBYE.

          • @Brent Rossiter
            First of all, thank you for your elaborate, sincere replies (and I mean that).

            I’m quite mad. Especially after writing what I just did before. I thought you were fair and descent despite our opposing views.

            I am sorry if I offended you, and good on you to tell me straight away.

            No, I don’t call you a liar, but this Will.B. person definitely is telling lies as well as highly incendiary claptrap (e.g. this thing about ‘Fauci’s bioweapons’). I am sorry if I misrepresented your words in my reply to him, but I think that this also has to do with the problem at hand: that we not only have difficulty to agree on facts, but we even seem to have the meta-problem of different views on the definition of the word ‘fact’.

            But before we get stuck in the mud again, we can maybe step back a little and give this another try.

            If I understand correctly, you don’t trust your government and your scientists because you feel that they impose relatively harsh and far-reaching measures while not properly informing people. OK so far?
            As a result, you say you ‘are sure’ that there’s an agenda – which I should probably read as ‘strongly believe’ instead of considering this as a statement of fact on your behalf.

            If the above is correct, I can proceed with this question about trust: on what sources of information do you base your opinions and beliefs? And why do you trust these sources to tell you the truth and not have an agenda, but not any official sources?
            If you e.g. get a lot of stuff off Facebook or Telegram or the likes, then you are dealing with information channels that most definitely have an agenda that you may not like: gather as much information as possible about as many people as possible, and sell that information for as much money as possible. To achieve this goal, these channels employ mechanisms (algorithms) that are both highly addictive and tend to drag people down rabbit holes from which they can only escape with great difficulty.

            These are of course tentative assumptions that may not apply to you at all, but I am curious if I’m far off the mark here.

          • Hi Richard, and thanks. I knew I was talking with someone good with principals. I also knew I’d check back in to see any further opinions etc. I did unsubscribe so wasn’t aware until coming back. My story is very umconventional and how I came to a decision too was a long long game of patience.

            I actually wouldn’t mind that much summarizing it, in long or short form. But about the here and now, I feel I’ve taken up far too much space already on this comment section. Wasn’t my intention at all. I have no, nor do I use any social media at all. I joined Facebook after buying my first laptop in 2010, but quit soon after. A showoff page as it felt to me really wasn’t my thing.

            I could write about my experience and how I came to the decision. But I’d have to spend some time writing then editing it down, as I’m aware I take up too many words explaining my point. To the point the point gets lost at times. Not sure how long it’d take either.

            But also there’s one thing I would have to advise you in advance and that is that I have decided now for better or worse, and am not going to reconsider. So this, whatever if I write it would only be of informative value. I don’t want anyone to be attempting to change my mind now. I’ve had problems saying no to people in the past, and when I feel I’m being pressured I back off. Not specifically talking covid here, but in all life now that’s what I do. .

            Also to uh… Lenny I think, I only saw the end half of what you wrote earlier. Really shocked me that amount of hate. I can assure you Lenny this hasn’t been a light decision, and God knows, I’ve she’d tears for untold victims who are unknown and unnamed to me. It’s truly devastating and I feel it very deep. And finally, no matter my choice or what I believe or think, I would never let my choice put at risk others. I am I guess lucky to be as near as hermit as anyone can today. Also the very late arrival of covid to N.Z allowed me time, a generous amount of time to decide what to do.

            I avoided both sides arguments as just too many wild theories simply can’t co-exist.
            (The virus can’t be made in wuhan if it doesn’t exist, So I’m not looking at any of this until i feel parts of what I hear at least sound plausible)
            as example from that side. And the govts side here was
            Keep looking directly at us and don’t turn your head nor look more than 3% left or right. Followed by ever increasing goodies for the good children and timeouts detentions and extra homework for the naughty. With tellings off that, from next week you’ll be grounded, and keep being naughty,then no phone. No pudding next, your not eating with us on fish n chip night, youll have to use the toilet outside if you won’t buck your ideas up,, wash from the water in the wheelbarrow, etc etc. Of course not, but the feeling is near to the same as I could imagine. I left school at 14, one year before ones allowed, and lived by choice on the streets for the next 2 full years. Despite there being a house, bed, bedroom and immediate family there.
            I didn’t know I still had those feelings buried deep deep inside still. Even being chased up, rounded up at times I’d refuse always. Boys home I was put in, despite no crime and that every other boy was there for car thefts burglaries etc. Oddly I enjoyed the 5 weeks there on my 1st time. And Unusually for the time (81-82) no abuse.

            I had to eventually decide of course, and had to lock it in which I have. Still doesn’t stop me reading up on both sides and taking in what I feel in myself right. I noticed, or believe I’ve noticed a very sharp eye or ear for even the slightest inconsistencies or contradictions. Huge surprise to myself, at 54 I thought and felt my ability to learn and absorb that much had really decreased since I was a kid. So tiny things would leap out at me.
            I dunno why but human stories and lives hit me hard. Everyone who’s suffered through this has hurt. I’m not like many others. Even the past days taking with you affected me, because in a strange way I can’t feel anonymous like many can. Every online conversation I have, I get real embarrassment, real anger, feel real friendship, real hurt. I know it’s odd. But still feel it odd that people can do the same anonymously and seemingly emotionlessly too. Most in fact do. The vast majority I guess do. I don’t know how, so decided it was pointless using a made up name. I’m just me and I’m here. Odd and very different. But also Richard, I have chosen my path. And accepted to live with that decision. Or not live, it’s the decision I made. I aim to not contract covid. And after much thinking too very unlikely I believe to put any other at risk.
            I’ll leave it there for now. And maybe check in tomorrow I guess. Oh God, I’ve written all that again and already. Uuugghh. I dunno.

            Thanks Richard. I knew I knew you were a good one.

          • @Brent Rossiter
            First off, it seems that you are just as long-winded in your comments as I am, haha! But I think it sometimes helps to get a nuanced opinion across, and you certainly succeeded here, so kudos!

            I’ll try to keep it short, and just pick a few things that caught my eye.

            I have decided now for better or worse, and am not going to reconsider

            Yes, this is quite clear clear, and when I said earlier that I wouldn’t try changing your mind, but that it was up to yourself, I wasn’t being sarcastic or trying to pull some sophistry trick. People should make up their own mind, and my only contribution is pointing out some information or points of view that may enhance or nuance their views(*). I certainly am not trying to convince or ‘convert’ people – I am most definitely not a car salesman or a religious zealot or a politician, and I would really hate it if people would join my side just because they are convinced by me. If anything, they should be convinced by facts and reason, so things that ultimately happen inside them.

            Still doesn’t stop me reading up on both sides and taking in what I feel in myself right.

            Well, you can’t say any fairer than that. Any conclusions you draw from what you take in are your own. The only thing I noticed myself is that one must be careful to keep taking in information from all sides to avoid ending up in an echo chamber with just One Doctrine (a.k.a. rabbit hole).

            I noticed, or believe I’ve noticed a very sharp eye or ear for even the slightest inconsistencies or contradictions.

            This sensitivity to patterns and clues is in fact a universal human trait, and one that is especially active in stressful situations. There is, however, one caveat: these pattern recognition skills are very often too sensitive, and we have a strong tendency to see patterns that aren’t really there – in fact, a lot of so-called alternative medicine (SCAM) and pseudoscience is based on this fallacy, mostly in the form of ‘My [ailment of choice] resolved after using [SCAM of choice] -> SCAM cured my ailment!’
            These way-too-sensitive pattern and clue recognition skills have a very good evolutionary explanation: when you think you see suspicious movement in the high grass, it is still far better to run away needlessly a hundred times than get eaten by a lion just once.
            This is also one of the things that science tries to overcome – but alas not always successfully, as even the most renowned scientists sometimes fall into this trap of seeing things that aren’t really there. The adage here is to always be critical – not just of what other people think and say, but especially also of your OWN beliefs and convictions. Of course it doesn’t mean that one should amble through life completely clueless, and that any personal convictions are by definition wrong – there’s also this thing called ‘being human’. And of course we all get things wrong from time to time. But that shouldn’t be a problem as long as we’re honest about it.

            Anyway, interesting and refreshing as this exchange is, I’ll cut it short (well … slightly shorter) here, and wish you all the best!

            *: Just as comments such as yours enrich my insights in the way other people see things.

          • Great follow up Richard. Funnily enough I again have to correct something I can’t quite believe I actually wrote and in the way I did.. Never say never would’ve been far better than giving that impression nothing in the future could or would change my choice. My Choice for now I’ll simply say. I always have to stay open to reconsideration in response to something no one can possibly predict. This thing is like an upended bucket of water.
            Writing that and in that total absolute and definitive way was another response I regret. I can only think I must’ve had an irrational fear (as its turned out} to being put under pressure or just that fear of that possibility made me think to write that??
            I’ll keep this on focus and add to Always reflect and reassess. These times really are something no one alive has ever come close to. Keep selfchecking. Must write these points down. Never say never especially in these times.

            Great stuff Richard. I must admit I’ve gained a fair bit from this quite bizarre at times and extraordinary exchange. And much appreciation for all the time and thought you yourself have put in.
            I’m sure I can move forward that more aware and prepared.
            Humanity..!! I feel like I hate Humans sometimes. Maybe despite of or in spite of Humanity I dunno. I wish well everyone right now though.. Everyone.

            Cheers Richard. An invaluable few days.
            Reflecting on everything. Felt insane at times, yes.
            But all for the best for sure.
            Pretty sure I don’t need to remind you to take care mate.

            Brent.

        • What Democrats do to silence the Truth,,, They start attacking the person to silence them Tactics of Satan .. Hang in there Ruthy ,

          • @hope

            You are right! Democrats are trying to silence the “truth” about vaccines and what is in those vaccines. I have been fighting to protect the vaccinated and unvaccinated alike. I have a business that manufactures all kinds of tinfoil hats for people who don’t trust the government and the big bad pharma. For you, I suggest our new line of bright red MAGA hats lined with tinfoil on the inside. You can wear this hat as a proud MAGA moron and hide the fact that you are tinfoil hatter, at the same time you get to reap the benefits of having a tinfoil on your head i.e., safe from all kinds of unsavory things (like 5G signals, vaccine nanobots etc.). By the way, if you don’t trust me, ask Ruthy. She bought all kinds of tinfoil hats from be before and is a satisfied customer.

            I donate some of the profits to Republican politicians and anti-vaxxer organizations, because the “truths” they help propagate and the gullible minds they influence tends to drive profits to my tinfoil hattery business.

          • I wonder what happened to the rules of this blog. They appear to be selective.

        • Yes, you tell them, Ruthy!

          It’s very concerning that so many people on the planet have fallen for this global scam, and are thus ‘believing’ the liars (governments, and the [corrupt, deceitful, lying] ‘mainstream’ Media, worldwide) and disbelieving the truth-tellers.

          We people around the world who are wised-up as to what’s really going on are being vilified for our ability to see through the ‘official narrative’.

          As you so rightly say, the people (above) who are ridiculing your post are the ones who are disconnected from reality, and not us. What a grave concern it is that so many people are still falling for the governments’ and Media’s propaganda, and not being aware of what’s REALLY going on.
          When will they all wise up… when it’s too late to save humanity???

          • @Christine Thompson

            I remember a Christine Thompson, not least for the following quite marvellous comment to me, but also for their prodigious commenting on the same article:
            https://edzardernst.com/2020/07/ex-doctor-andrew-wakefield-better-to-die-as-a-free-man-than-live-as-a-slave-and-get-vaccinated-against-covid-19/#comment-125130

            Pete Attkins:

            On the eventual day on which you do what is so very wrongly termed ‘die’, you will get the biggest shock; for when that day eventually arrives, for you, you will discover, in a way which it will be impossible for you to deny, that you HAVE survived the death of your PHYSICAL body ‘coat’.

            It doesn’t matter that you don’t “believe” what I say; just you wait until that day arrives, for you. And on THAT day, you will be singing a completely different tune from that which you have very ignorantly manifested above.

            There is something very wrong with the humans who think in the way in which you RABID sceptics do; you all blatantly refuse to address the veritable wealth of multi-faceted evidences (of which, as I have stated several times, in my posts on this site over the last few days, there are MORE THAN 20 DIFFERENT CATEGORIES) which truly do provide absolute truth for the fact of everyone’s survival of the death of their physical body ‘coat’.

            And anyone on Earth who has even a modicum of intelligence is fully aware that Wikipedia is a deeply corrupt “information source”; that it ALWAYS takes an extremely ridiculing stance re. anything that is not ‘orthodox’/’mainstream’/materialistic/atheistic.

            There will eventually come a day for each and every one of you immensely uninformed, materialistic people, when you will have to face the horrific truth that it was YOU LOT who were wrong, and NOT the many, many millions of properly-informed, spiritually-enlightened people on Earth. And when that day does eventually come, for you all, THEN you will have to take a long, hard, look at yourselves, and will have to face that there was something ‘missing’ in your system, something which prevented you from addressing the incontrovertible evidences (and that goes for the fact that ‘vaccines’ are a proven medical fraud/hoax, as well as the absolutely proven fact of everyone’s survival [in our immortal spirit body form] of the death of our PHYSICAL body ‘coat’).

            I pity you all. You extreme sceptics. For there IS something ‘missing’ in your systems. Something which makes you all have a need to cling to the materialistic view of existence, which is why you are all forced to trot out all the (uninformed, pathetic) sceptic websites. Wikipedia/’rational’wiki, Skepdic, James Randi, Richard Dawkins, Chris French, Richard Wiseman, Ray Hyman, Peter Atkins [of Cambridge University], and so on, and so on. There will eventually come a day for the people who produce those ridiculing sites, and all the above ‘professional sceptics’, a day on which THEY will have to face that it was THEY who were wrong, and not the many people they ridiculed so vilely.

            You are all pathetic.

            Well done!

  • Rights and Freedoms blog, good to know that is where your morning news Ruthy!

    They take crypto only. You gotta wonder why. Perhaps they are too lazy to set up a Go Fund Me account?

    Also, I am having a hard time finding the name of the person(s) behind that blog. I guess it is better to stay anonymous if one is posting pure BS fighting a cabal of global “Elites”.

    Cant help but notice that the language used in that blog is specifically targeted towards gullible freedumb loving folks here in USA.

    • You especially Talker.
      Anon keyboard hero. Your attitude is really so much like mob mentality but with anonymity.
      Good on you tough talker. Hope you feel big and proud. Actually no, I don’t. I hope you read yourself actually.

      Brent Rossiter

  • What is the Infection Fatality Rate of Covid 19, Edzard? Why isn’t the media talking about it any more?
    What is the average age of a ‘Covid’ death, Edzard? Why, it’s the same as the average age of death from all causes, isn’t it! Which means there is no ‘pandemic’.

    Care to discuss?

    Thought not.

    How did Christian Drosten manage to get his paper on Covid 19 peer reviewed in 24 hours, Edzard?

  • Thanks to website for allowing difference of opinions.
    Too many don’t now and it’s that more than many other things that have turned me so suspicious.

    • I would like to add that I do think this virus IS real and does kill.
      I’m just very suspicious of this whole 2 years.
      And finally, I hope I’m wrong. I’d like to be, I want to be wrong.
      So much that I’ll give my life to it to be wrong and everyone is working for humanities best interests.
      I want that. I hope it’s so.

      Brent

  • You are one of the few honest web-sites to allow different opinions. We are living in a Cancel world at the moment.This is fundamentally wrong. Great watching. I hope the legal battle is ongoing and I too believe that good always wins over bad. Such is basic understanding of natural law.

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